Talk:Clef
From Academic Kids
I've taken a stab at integrating all the clef atricles here, as per the discussion on Talk:treble clef. I'll wait to change the others to redirects until I hear your comments. -- Merphant
- I like the integration very much - the whole thing seems much clearer now, with the potential confusion between G clef and Treble clef virtually eliminated. Go ahead and make the other clef pages redirects.
- Just one thing: maybe it would be best to put the images under "G clef", "F clef" and "C clef" rather than under "Treble clef", etc. That way we know what they look like from the start. This makes it a bit tricky to distinguish between alto and tenor clefs, but probably the thing to do is to put the alto clef under "C clef" and keep the image of the tenor clef where it is. Otherwise, this is great! --Camembert
- Or, here's another idea I've just had - how about making the "Treble clef" section a subsection to "G clef", "Bass clef" a subsection to "F clef" and "Alto clef" and "Tenor clef" subsections to "C clef"? So the overall scheme of the article would become:
- G clef
- Treble clef
- Violin clef [or whatever else you want to call it, when I get round to writing about it]
- F clef
- Bass clef
- Baritone clef [if anybody ever wants to write about it]
- C clef
- Alto clef
- Tenor clef
- [any other C clefs that people want to write about]
Obviously, I don't mean to use bullet points, you'd do it with headings, I guess. The more I think about this, the more I like the idea of it. I won't touch anything for now though. --Camembert
Yeah, I was thinking of laying it out like that too - group by clef symbol then by clef. BTW, anyone got any idea where to find an image of the old-style F-clef, same quality as the existing images? -- Tarquin
Ok, done. As for the other F clef, Your best bet is probably to find some printed music that uses it and scan it in. I made the others with Finale, but it doesn't seem to have that symbol in any of its fonts. It does have the F and G clefs with the 8, but I don't think those are really necessary to have here. -- Merphant
- I have some music that has the old F clef that I can scan if necessary, but I'll look around for a better quality image first. I've scoured Sibelius (the program, not the, erm, composer), but can't find it in any of the fonts there, unfortunately. --Camembert
Multiple clefs
This paragraph is inaccurate:
- But why all these different clefs? Although only four are common today, as many as eight have been used previously. The reason is, oddly not a musical but a mechanical one. In the days of early music printing presses (i.e, during the Renaissance), ledger lines were difficult to print, so a wide variety of clefs were subsequently used.
In fact, the use of moveable clefs long precedes printed music; it goes back to Gregorian chant. However, avoidance of ledger lines was certainly a prime motivation. I'll try and find some examples of Gregorian chant clefs. --Wahoofive 05:14, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Huge graphics
Why are the graphics so huge? --Wahoofive 05:19, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Minor reorg
I'd like to propose a minor reorg:
- Move the section called "Notes" to the bottom, and give it a more descriptive name
- Create a new section header after the first paragraph (perhaps "Use of clefs") to bring the TOC higher up Wikipedia:Guide_to_Layout.
- Add a section at the bottom for historical information.
Actually, most of the "notes" strike me as kind of meaningless, but if we want to keep this information, it could be presented more effectively. I'll work on it.
--Wahoofive 05:27, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)
